Spec Manifold Deposit Requirement

[hardingfv32-1]

We now have a good chance that SCCA Enterprises will administer a Spec FV Manifold. I base this on the theory that SCCA derives the majority of it revenue from membership fees and memberships are maintaining a declining trend. So a source of revenue from Enterprises is welcomed. And from SCCA's point of view, who better to administer a Spec FV Manifold?

First, we will ASSUME that the Spec Manifold can be delivered at the promised price and operating specifications. By definition this makes it better than the best Nat manifolds. These Spec Manifolds, of coarse, will not be mandatory under the rules but if only a few are sold then they do become informally mandatory if you want to be competitive. The whole reason for the Spec Manifold is so everyone can be equal as far as manifold performance, right? I would say then that this it is a safe assumption that all competitive minded National race competitors will want to purchase a Spec Manifold then.

This means an additional $400-500 purchase for most Nat and some Reg competitors. I question how many really want to put up the money. I believe that the Spec Manifold issue is being driven by a small number of competitors. If this is approved, then once one Spec Manifold is put into competition it becomes competitively mandatory to have one.

I propose that a minimum of 75 deposits be required before a Spec Manifold can be approved and go into competition. This will insure that a large number of competitors really want a Spec FV Manifold. There are already 58 on board, how hard will it be to get the extra 17 if the price target is met?

Brian

[jpetillo]

Brian,

Although Dietmar stated in the Feb Ad Hoc Meeting minutes that "58 were in favor of a spec manifold. 36 were opposed." when I asked the committee for clarification, I was told that "A vote of YES, means you want a Spec Man to be CONSIDERED – at all – EVER – now or later." (The emphasis in the quote was not added by me.)

To me, that's a somewhat different question the membership was voting on than whether we were in favor of a spec manifold for 2012.

I'm not trying to pour water on your proposal - actually I think it's an interesting concept - just mentioning that there may be less true "yes" votes than the number of 58 would lead us to believe.

I also believe the FV Registry has over 300 SCCA FV folks listed. Do you think 75 deposits may be sufficient in that light?

John

[JimR]

Not that this will deter the ad hoc committee from continuing to believe there is consensus for their cause, but here goes.
I DO NOT SUPPORT the ad hoc committee continuing to pursue a replacement to the existing manifold used in FV by replacement of the VW part that has been used in this class since its inception.
Jim Regan

[Matt King]

Send your letter to the committee or the CRB.

[Greg Davis]

Just as a novel concept, why not press the SCCA, for the benefit of the class and possibly increased memberships, entry fees etc., to forego their markup on the manifolds. I don't know much about tooling up and casting a piece similar to the stock manifold, but offering one at $400-$500 seems a bit steep to me. If it could be offered in the $200 range, I think it would have a much broader acceptance within the Vee rank and file.

[Erik Oseth]

We now have a good chance that SCCA Enterprises will administer a Spec FV Manifold. I base this on the theory that SCCA derives the majority of it revenue from membership fees and memberships are maintaining a declining trend. So a source of revenue from Enterprises is welcomed. And from SCCA's point of view, who better to administer a Spec FV Manifold?

First, we will ASSUME that the Spec Manifold can be delivered at the promised price and operating specifications. By definition this makes it better than the best Nat manifolds. These Spec Manifolds, of coarse, will not be mandatory under the rules but if only a few are sold then they do become informally mandatory if you want to be competitive. The whole reason for the Spec Manifold is so everyone can be equal as far as manifold performance, right? I would say then that this it is a safe assumption that all competitive minded National race competitors will want to purchase a Spec Manifold then.

This means an additional $400-500 purchase for most Nat and some Reg competitors. I question how many really want to put up the money. I believe that the Spec Manifold issue is being driven by a small number of competitors. If this is approved, then once one Spec Manifold is put into competition it becomes competitively mandatory to have one.

I propose that a minimum of 75 deposits be required before a Spec Manifold can be approved and go into competition. This will insure that a large number of competitors really want a Spec FV Manifold. There are already 58 on board, how hard will it be to get the extra 17 if the price target is met?

Brian

So you know there will not be any money put up period by any members to pusue the spec intake. Any company worth there salt will do all the work with no money down.I have already checked noone will need to put any cash up.


Erik

[FV80]

Just as a novel concept,... If it could be offered in the $200 range, I think it would have a much broader acceptance within the Vee rank and file.

If we go the way of Spec, the price will be as inexpensive as can be managed. If we were making 20,000 of them, $200 might be possible, but with the relatively small quantities involved, I think that getting them for under $500 will be an achievement. I wonder what the going rate is for a core VW manifold ... BrianH, you've probably acquired a few in recent times. Can you buy 'new' ones, or is everything coming from junkyards these days??
Steve, FV80

[brian]

Ok Steve, you know it's just from wrecking yards. I pay about $30 for a virgin , when I can find them.

[hardingfv32-1]

It is my belief that there are very few competitors willing to support a Spec Manifold with their money. Talk is cheap. Once one Spec Manifold is approved and goes into service, then everyone who wants to stay competitive will have to have one. This would be a perfect way for SCCA Enterprises to guaranty a market for their Spec Manifold. Requiring a certain number of deposits should provide some confidence that the Spec Manifold is what the majority of the class wants. This has nothing to do with a supplier's possible production requirements.

Manifolds are still available from junk yards, although the prices are climbing, were $15-20, now $25-45. More than enough to cover the few that are sold each year. It can not be argue that we are running out of used manifolds.

Brian

[72jeff]

I'm sure many of us have plenty of cores and/or regional manifolds that can be reworked sitting in our garages.........I have at least six.

jeff