LimeRock no longer a momentum track

[Rickydel]

The character of Lime Rock will be altered greatly.

See:

http://www.timlinerud.com/racing/Lime_R ... nges-1.pdf

[FV80]

Looks like ALL the tracks are eliminating anything that could be considered 'FUN' and replacing it with MUCH slower 'stuff'. Too many lawyers in this country, I think
Steve

[vreihen]

Can you please enlighten me as to where this info came from and what kind of timeline they are talking about for making these changes?????

[hardingfv32-1]

No lawyers involved here...just trying to meet the demand of the most customers.

Lime Rock might be just right for a Vee, but it probably is too fast for a modern professional race series. Also remember motorcycles are used just as much as cars at most tracks. They have different safety issues. Next we add street supercars and motorcycles to the mix and the picture gets more complex. SCCA racing at most tracks is just a footnote on the calendar.

Brian

[problemchild]

This has been ongoing for quite some time. Check out
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25906

It is all about lawyers .... and stock brokers ..... and wealthy East coast motorheads who want to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to parade around "Skippy's Auto Country Club". Club racing and Pro racing are insignificant in Skippy's master plan.

[hardingfv32-1]

When you say lawyers and stockbrokers, is this just another way of saying wealthy people?

Brian

[problemchild]

I personally have no issue with people who are wealthy. It is obvious however that the new Lime Rock will be catering to a specific crowd than has only been part of the 50+ year history of the track. My parents were there in the 50s. I was there last year. We will not be "members".
I am not sure that you can argue with Skippy's lastest business model, but a lot of people are feeling betrayed. "Selling out" is rarely understood by the supporters of those that "move on".

[CitationFV21]

Before eveyone gets in an uproar, the existing track, the "classic" Lime Rock is being preserved, so groups may have a choice over which track to run. The ALMS cars will probably run the "new" course while the SCCA may have options as to what parts they want to run. One advantage is that if they use the "new" course, the guys from NHIS will not have to change gearboxes as it will now become a definte short box track.

The question is, will it be a more fun and challenging track? Or will it be too much like and autocross?

ChrisZ

[jpetillo]

Brian brings up a good point about motorcycles. They simply could not run them on the current (old) configuration - zero runoff room until you hit a wall or trees. Cars might spin to the inside, but bikes slide to the outside. The new configuration looks like it's possible, and they may have a new revenue stream.

Oh, and Skip just added an associates membership (or whatever it's called) - 10 years/$10K.

I'm not arguing about lawyers vs. wealthy people here, just adding some thoughts.

John

[Frank]

Thats too bad. Lime lock was suck a thrill. I'm glad I got to drive there before it got screwed up. Oh well long live nelson ledges and summit point.

[jjflip]

Look i am far from a fan of private, club type race tracks for the rich and famous...im neither, but yet have an immensely strong desire to go racing. I havent raced this year because of having NO MONEY!!! (well not enough to justify the expense..yet) I have been adamantly against what has happened to LRP....but in reading this i had an epiphany. You have to look at it from a business standpoint. I didnt see LRP getting paved, or improved much with the way things have been running the past 5 or 6 years, and that includes the price increases we have seen in that time period. It was just a slow degredation of the track surface and run off areas, even the food vendor was low balled and the quality of the food took a turn for the worse a few years ago. So low and behold the owner starts selling "memberships" for extreme amounts of money (coming from this unemployed cabinetmaker anyway) and BAM the entire place is being redone. It will bring in new events, a growth spurt, and probably even a profitable business, of course i have no idea if it made or lost money in the past, this is all speculation.
So now once this is all done, and the bills are paid for the re-do, then maybe we can hope that the track becomes more reasonably priced...for us non members. ...or something to that effect anyway.

Jeff

[72jeff]

There is video of the new track on youtube.......it's not at speed, but you can see the new track

[Rickydel]

Two laps in a BMW with David Brahbam at the wheel.

http://www.ashcom.homestead.com/LRP_Brabham.wmv

I was under the impression a club could use the traditional LRP layout. Maybe construction isn't quite done yet, but it looks to me like West Bend is a permanent chicane.
Hard to tell on the video, but it looks like the left hander is banked on camber now, for its full width. I had a friend once that drove a Sports Renault. He had a hell of a time with either going slow or spinning in the left hander. He couldn't believe it after I told him not to approach it all the way on the right side of the track.
Surface sure looks nice.

[CitationFV21]

The "classic" track is still there. There are some videos on youtube where one car does West Bend and one car the "new turn".

BTW - for all those who wondered how much these new turns would slow the cars down, the P2 cars were doing 44.6 with the "chicane" last year. The pole today with both the new uphill and west bend is 46.6. Now the track went from 1.53 to 1.51 but the cars have to be flying up the hill which has a new spectator area (same with West Bend). If the ALMS cars were runnign the "Classic" Course I would bet they would be under 40 seconds........

I hope to give a first hand look as I plan on stopping by tomorrow.

ChrisZ

[CitationFV21]

Okay - back from the track - here is the first impressions:

1. There were lots of people there. When you figure there was only really 1 race (2 minor support races) and only 30 ALMS cars, then 20,000 + people came to watch 30 cars......... (of course having Marco there didn't hurt)

2. The track surface is smooth and does not appear to have broken up at all (my theory why later)

3. The new uphill and west (bend) turn (need to come up with new names) were loved by spectators and hated by drivers. The new uphill adds a very heavy braking (well maybe not in a Vee) zone and then a single file run up the hill. Looks like fun to drive but not as much fun as the old Uphill. The new west (bend) turn again has a very fast entry, hard braking and a neat right left transition. If a FV went through there EVERYONE could do the downhill flat out.

4. Curbing - too low, might have well be track. The fact that the asphalt didn't come up was partially due to the amount of sand blowing across as cars cut the corners. Off line there was sand and rocks.

5. New viewing area at West Bend will be a very popular spot - great place to watch a race from.

All in all they accomlished a lot in 30 days and it paid off. However, they need to do some tweaks for next year.

1. Don't change No Name! (besides some curbing)
2. Open up the entry to the new uphill
3. raise the curbs
4. Put in a reentry road for people who go off in the outside of the 2nd part of Big Bend.
5. Lengthen pit lane a add the new pit lane entrance (planned)

Do we need any of the new stuff with FV? - No

Will it be fun for car clubs and time trials? Yes

Are there little things I have missed? Yes - more areas are paved, better drainage in others, other things I probably missed.

More as I think of them.

ChrisZ

[JimR]

Chris,
You mention a left right transition in what was west bend. Does this change the track such that the main straight is possible with a short box? Any thoughts.
Jim

[CitationFV21]

If they run the "Classic" track, a long box will be even more important as the track is smooth and faster than the last repaving (where some FV's were in the 59's!)

If either of the alternate turns are used, then a shortbox becomes a necessity.

Remember, the downhill and main straight are not changed, so in theory, a shortbox will still run out of revs at the end of the straight. It would be such an advantage on other parts of the track however, to overcome the one place a long box has a strength.

Even though they hate it, the ALMS cars will keep running the alternate west bend. If not, I saw one estimate that the Audi's could do 190 mph at the end of the straight!